>Parents explain ,that the Math issue is complex and requires reading and research. They have done that, and they now hope that BOE is reading what they have read.
The article linked below is from the New York Times, from years back when TERC and CMP were implemented in the NY city schools.
The parents at VORMATH think that “reformed” math is an incongruous fit for the demographic of Ridgewood.
We deliver bright and engaged children to the schools who don’t need Math to be “fun” and “creative” for them to get it.
Perhaps the crux of our dislike of TERC Investigations and CMP Math is that was created for lower achievers.
https://www.nytimes.com/library/national/regional/042700ny-math-edu.html
>Here’s a more recent New York Times article.
>One board member expressed “insult” when told that reformed math was for inner city children. He, Vallerini, couldn’t stand the fact that he and his administrators were supporting an inner-city geared program for Ridgewood. But, Mr. Vallerini, if you read the NY Times article you will see that that is EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE DOING. Save the insult for yourself. We’ve had enough of your insults.
GET THIS CRAP OUT OF OUR SCHOOLS NOW!
Our kids will learn real math; they don’t need to be teased with smiley faces, balloons around numbers, folding sheets of paper, using eye-catching tricks to add and subtract, writing endless explanations of their “thinking.”
Newsflash: They are not afraid of the word “equations.” Stop calling it a “math sentence.”
That is the real insult.
>OK. I am both a resident AND a teacher in the district. I have two things to say. One is, I don’t like the math programs taught here, and I am not even sure my kid’s west side school uses either of the programs you mention! I know that he is made over and over to write, write, write to explain his thinking. He is in 4th grade and hates to write but really feels strong in math. This is quickly changing. He doesn’t “like” it anymore. He even said (his words, not mine) “I hate math, they don’t teach us the traditional way anymore.” At least his teacher uses this term and will show it to them, even if briefly.
That being said, I take issue with your statement of “We deliver bright and engaged children to the schools who don’t need Math to be “fun” and “creative” for them to get it.” While some are bright and engaged, the majority ask me, “Are we going to do something fun today?” They want novel, they want exciting, they want different. They immediately tune out what doesn’t have a “hook.” The majority of the students today are not “engaged,” rather they are looking to be engaged, and this task falls to the teacher.
>The examples in the article show elegant (in their simplicity) traditional algorithms being swapped out for unweildy and needlessly complex algorithms.
>Hmmm…I had to look up “short bus.” Doesn’t the RHS principal have a doctorate in vocational technology education? No, I’m not kidding.
>How will kids progress to abstract thinking required in upper level math, using universally known symbols and numbers, while they are busy drawing dozens of circles to cross out instead doing simple subtraction computations?
There are also not enough practice examples to help create automaticity.
>In response to the teacher’s comment above: I hear ya.
But you know what? My kids are in this district too, and they get all the glitzy fun stuff too.
But when they come home to me, we do hard work. Real work, without the fun. Without the glitzy pictures. Without the novel and exciting. Their math materials are Amish-like, to paint a picture for ya.
They’ve come to expect this at home. Children get used to what they’re given, and come to expect it.
And in the end, my kids love their math sessions at home. Because they play games? Nope. Because they crave the satisfaction of a challenge and a job well done. They like the seriousness of it all. And they look forward to their math lessons at home. They’re excelling in math at home, and that makes them feel really really good.
I wish my kids’ teachers would say “In THIS class, we work hard. We don’t have to make everything fun all the time. And you’re going to feel real good about what you’ve learned in this class. So drop your expectations. Our class is DIFFERENT.”
There’s nothing stopping any teacher from doing this. I thank God for teachers who do this.
>Bravo 8:24
DO you think you would ever be picked to be part of the math discussion as described by Vallerini – if that ever is to come to be? And if so, would you be candid and truthful with your thoughts?
>.. keep the math discussion IN THE PUBLIC and not behind closed doors
and for the other parents out there – while you have 4 minutes to speak at the microphone there is nothing wrong with keeping is short and simple:
walk to the microphone, where you state your name and address, and then say “I do not like the math program.”
then go home.
>Anonymous said…
Hmmm…I had to look up “short bus.” Doesn’t the RHS principal have a doctorate in vocational technology education? No, I’m not kidding.
To Anonymous,
I believe the “Short Bus” comment is a reference to Special Education Children. Back when pj went to school the short bus was the bus that transported children with learning disabilities to and from school.
Is the use of this term objectionable, maybe, maybe not? Could a better example have been used, of course!
I wonder pj …were you one of those kids who made fun of the kids on the short bus?.
Your friendly Village Idiot
>”picked to be part of the math discussion”
We don’t have to be “picked.” We already have a legal right to discuss it at BOE meetings. Too bad if he wants to hide the warts. Don’t let him.
If Vallerini “picks” you, then who are you to have access to special info that the rest of us don’t get to have? Who are you to be engaged in a secret discussion that excludes the majority of residents in Ridgewood? What makes you so special that you would represent all of Ridgewood?
Don’t succumb to being flattered by being “picked.” If you care about truth and reform, then keep everything open and above board.
>in response to 6:30 am
Education is not about liking or disliking things. When something is found to be inadequate or lacking, it needs to be addressed.
Reasons why parents are opposed to reform math are important and should not be stifled.
Despite clear reasons and supporting evidence that can be easily watched on You Tube videos as many times as necessary, Board member Vallerini states he doesn’t understand the problems with the math curriculum.
It’s obvious explanations of the deficiencies of TERC Investigations are still quite necessary by parents who need to attend Board meetings and remain while discussions ensue.
Signing the petition says I do not agree with the math program. Over 175 people have already done that.
It’s time for the Board to take action in addressing this issue.
>8:24
Thank you for speaking on this Blog. We need to hear from teachers like you. I know if given a choice, kids will pick “fun” over “work.” Who wouldn’t? We go to work but would rather go to the beach.
Remember, they are children, but we are the adults and we have to set the tone of expectations, not match theirs.
If my teachers did not raise the bar, how could I raise it as a child? The difference in other countries is that educators don’t spend time trying to figure out how to make kids like school. Why can’t we learn to stop this silly game and just teach them till they get it.
Just tell them “fun” starts AFTER 3 o’clock.
>Yes, it’s good to hear from teachers, especially those in the trenches in our own District. Thanks for what you do. I know that you need all the smarts and creativity and energy you can muster to keep kids engaged.
There are plenty of parents who will back you when you tell students that there’s nothing wrong with hard work.
Dr. Mucciolo once told a true story about parents who had come to him, worried because their kid’s self esteem might suffer in Helen Aslanides’ tough class. When Mucciolo talked to Helen about this, she answered, “He’ll work hard and THAT will help his self esteem.” My kid was lucky enough to have her and other great teachers in this district.
>Oh I agree. I’m so happy to hear teachers speak up. I can’t imagine the pressure you teachers might be under, not liking the math and not being able to say anything.
I believe there are teachers out there who are counting on us parents to raise heck. You teachers cannot do that, and I certainly understand why. We all have something to protect.
Knowing there are teachers counting on me helps me stay strong in this fight. Believe me, I’d much rather quit and make nice.
>9:24 am said
“Don’t succumb to being flattered by being “picked.” If you care about truth and reform, then keep everything open and above board. “
Let’s be realistic.
If the district or BOE sets up a committee to discuss math, meetings will probably not be held publicly.
People (teachers, parents, administration) will be selected or picked to represent others.
>Let’s be realistic…the only way to get at the truth and implement reform is through an independent grassroots organization demanding accountability.
The BOE can form all the committees it wants. This does not prevent residents from continuing to speak at BOE meetings and demand answers, as they did on Long Island.
This also does not prevent residents from demanding the minutes of these committee meetings, which are OPRA documents. In fact, any resident can attend these meetings even if not “picked.” All they have to do is to show up, because if these are BOE meetings they are still PUBLIC meetings.
These meetings matter only if they have any credibility, which they won’t because Mr. Vallerini’s comments and the BOE’s actions, particularly that of hiring a hard-line constructivist, make it clear that the deck will be stacked at these meetings, as it has been in other BOE meetings where participants are hand-picked. These meetings will be held only to rubber-stamp existing policy.
I don’t really care whether Mr. Vallerini forms a committee. I’m sure that the smart and courageous parents who have spoken at the mike will not be fooled into joining. And, if a committee’s bogus report is presented, I’m sure these parents will not hesitate to ferret out and publicize its “mistakes.”
If Mr. Vallerini or any other BOE member tries to imply that residents who refuse to join committees are not acting in good faith, then I will be happy to publicly rebuke these officials, bearing personal witness to what happens in these meetings, where critics are bullied are marginalized.
>correction: “bullied AND marginalized.”
>I agree with much of what 12:25 pm says however…
Minutes aren’t always timely, accurate or precise documents.
Not participating in a committee is not helping get to a solution.
That said,
Keeping the concerns in front of the BOE and demanding action is very important.
Never allow your concerns about your children’s education to be marginalized or feel bullied. That’s unacceptable.
Learn from what happened in Long Island. Parents spoke up and teachers did also through the committee. Although the deck was clearly stacked against them.
The community became active and well-aware of the disparity of how administration was representing the teacher’s views (they all love TERC) and what was really the case (many didn’t and were supplementing the heck out of it)and demanded a fair look at the situation. They refused to settle for anything less.
The teachers union supported the efforts against Investigations and gave the teachers courage to speak honestly against something the superintendent strongly supported. There were some teachers who liked the program, but the consensus went the other way.
Not suprisingly, the parents who eventually became the leaders of the renegade math group were not selected to be parent members of the math committee, which was formed prior to the petition and pobmath.com.
Again, not suprisingly, the selection process of the parents on the math committee became an issue as well.
Despite this, it was agreed by all that the parents who served on the math committee worked hard and did a great job of expressing concerns and had the support of the petition and continuing BOE public participation against TERC helping make their voices even stronger.
The story can be followed in more detail on http://www.pobmath.com through the letters and communications sent through the community.
>what so bad about the shortbus.the same people who rode that bus is in some big jobs in the schools.
>Point taken about the minutes.
If you agree to work in secret and join a BOE committee, then you might want to demand that it be taped.
Otherwise, the minutes might bear no resemblance to what you remember.
Especially if it’s a meeting presided over by Sheila Brogan.
>OK…. I’m the teacher who posted at “8:24” the other night. Here’s the deal. My class isn’t either fun OR learning, it is often both. Some days, like when I’m introducing new material, it’s taking notes, listening intently, asking insightful questions and having meaningful discussion. Other days, it’s applying what we’ve learned in more “real life” situations (I teach a foreign language). It’s not mutually exclusive. I wanted to make that clear. I also want to make clear that I have high standards and many kids live up to them and get that sense of accomplishment by doing so or in striving to do so.
I do not teach math, so I don’t feel that I would have much to add to any sort of panel that might or not be chosen. I could only speak to that issue as a (math-challenged to boot!) parent.
The other thing is… I teach an elective course, a language. If my class isn’t a. interactive, b. informative (so the kids can see results), c. novel at times and yes d. fun at times, they won’t choose my language, my program will die, I will lose my job. What do you do when faced with that?
I do not feel that I am comprimising myself, my values, the students’ learning if we play bingo with new vocabulary, if they create a crossword with it, if they do a Jeopardy type review for a test and the like. They are seeing the material and processing it ONE MORE TIME and for some kids in this district (yes, THIS district) that is all they will do— many do not go home and study, amazing as that sounds. So I will do anything to excite them about the learning, get them to process what they’ve learned (saying it, hearing it, reading it, manipulating/using it) and more importantly in my eyes is that they are so enthused by it that they continue to study the language.
Let’s remember, this is the I-Pod generation, the TV, video, CD, DVD, T-Vo generation…. add to that ADD, medications, differences in personality, in aptitude, in learning styles… you can see how challenging a job teaching is. A good teacher, however, will present materials in enough different ways so that it will reach each and every kid (if they are successful). It seems to be a general trend though, for textbooks to not include enough “practice” or “drills.” Mine certainly doesn’t. I end up creating most of my material to supplement that.
I hope I haven’t bored you all and that you understand where I am coming from.
I don’t like the way math is taught these days any more than you do. However, a good teacher will supplement and enrich the curriculum.
>The BOE contineous to forget the basics. They are elected members with the responsibility to SERVER the Taxpayers of Ridgewood! In all of the videos of the BOE, it is clear they simply don’t care what the parents and the taxpayers of Ridgewood think. They will always continue to seek out the people who agree with them. VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE!
>5:42 thanks! it’s helpful to have even more of a window into what it’s like for a teacher.
Do you think teachers feel free to publicly express their reservations about programs like the math program in our District?
>Dear teacher, thanks for clarifying that.
>”A good teacher, however, will present materials in enough different ways so that it will reach each and every kid (if they are successful). It seems to be a general trend though, for textbooks to not include enough “practice” or “drills.” Mine certainly doesn’t. I end up creating most of my material to supplement that.”
Well said. Varying teaching has ALWAYS been the hallmartk of a good teacher. You’re also right that the math is pretty vacant. That’s why there’s so much supplementation going on.
But math is the worst subject for that to happen to, especially because teachers vary a great deal in their own comfort with math.
It seems like you’re walking a fence on this subject. Have you reseached the math enough to really have an opinion? Seems like you’re more of a casual, distant observer, and in fact, one with his or her own math issues; those tend to be the teachers most defensive about the program.
They’re trying to improve on their own childhoods. Misguided.
>HAHA ya see that “A Tradition Of Excellence” and we make the record for a food fight!!!!
>o go call the ridgewood news.hua.