April 12,2016
the staff of the Ridgewood
Ridgewood NJ, Its2BIG Garage petition was completed on Tuesday afternoon! It was cheerfully accepted with 1227 signatures ,many more signatures than were needed. It’s a great day for democracy.
“Thank you so much to everybody who supported our petition. Total signatures: 1,227. The BCIA ordinance has been rescinded. It is our understanding that the local bond is now suspended until the council takes further action on our petition. One level down, shovels in the ground. Power to the people!”
Saurabh Dani,Dana Glazer,Ellen Mcnamara,Lorraine Reynolds,Melanie McWilliams
They did a great job. Worked harder that the villaga manager or mayor.
Time to stop Valley now
great job. thanks for all your hard work and efforts.
Incredible amount of work and all worth it. Now Albert and his developer buddies will not be making quite so much money on the backs of Ridgewood taxpayers.
So does the town have to vote to approve your petition of one level down?
9:05am, the town has to either repeal local bond and issue a new one which clearly mentions 3 stories 4 levels as part of the bond ordinance. Or the council can call a special election costing us 40k and voters can decide this in June or this can wait till Nov election if the council follows the law.
9:14am-
Please don’t provide such a one-sided view of the special election situation. The village’s attorney has issued an opinion that a special election is required by the law. The petitioner’s attorney believes that a special election is optional. That’s the situation, nothing more, nothing less.
John V. – – the village council can clear the issue up by repealing what its done and re-setting everything so it doesn’t cost money, no?
John V. The troll returns. No. The village attorney didn’t say that. The BOND attorney read only part of the language involved to make it sound as if the only option was a special election. Anyone can do that. And anyone gullible enough can just haplessly believe what this band of liars and thugs sells them and then recklessly spew it as truth.
Your one sided view is that the attorney this group used is wrong but that the village bond attorney is right. (Wonder how much a bond attorney cost us…? But you don’t say THAT do you) Why is your view better?? In fact, the longer you troll these people, who get out there and actually work towards a goal using a legal procedure, the more you work in their favor. No one I can find anywhere likes YOU, many people like THEM. I wonder how many “maybe” signatures your constant trolling sent their way…?
Hi John, did you give same advice to Roberta and Gwenn?
“Please don’t provide such a one-sided view of the special election situation.”
Bond counsel wants the bond to issue. Easy to spot that little nugget of self-interest.
I vote to rethink the entire garage situation. It’s dumb. I have shown the site to visitors and described it to other friends. They just shake their heads.
John v. The village attorney, Matt Rogers said no such thing. The bond counsel said that, clearly out of his area of expertise
John V. Crawl back under your rock.
The bond counsel is talking his own self-interest… Greed ain’t good here.
11:37am-
Apologies, you are correct. I should have written “bond counsel”, not village’s attorney.
10:15am-
Yup, they certainly could do that if they wanted to avoid the cost. I expect they’ll send it to a public vote instead. And the petitioners could withdraw their petition as well to avoid the cost. I expect they won’t. I’m fine seeing it voted on publicly!
10:29am-
Thanks for your correction. You’re totally right that it was the outside bond counsel who offered that opinion, not the village attorney. Apologies for that mistake.
I think if you re-read my original note above (and also my comments on FB), you’ll see that I’ve offered no opinion on “who’s right” about the special election. I place no special weight on the village bond counsel’s advice, or the petitioner attorney’s advice. I am not a lawyer by any means. I’ve suggested to the petitioners that they add an appropriate caveat before talking about a special election. I’ve made the same suggestion to Roberta and others as well, to stay consistent.
I’m sorry you can’t find anyone who likes me. I suggest you talk to more of my friends!
If my engagement on the garage issue has encouraged more people to support the “Its2Big” petition, that’s fine with me! I’m not trying to play politics or help one side “win”. I’m interested in the facts of the situation above all, and that’s mostly what I engage in discussion about.
11:07am-
Yes, I have indeed given the exact same advice to Gwenn and Roberta, thank you for asking. Anyone who has followed the Facebook discussions on this topic will have seen me correct the “yes” side multiple times (particularly Gwenn, who seems to constantly get the details wrong).
John V. April 13, 2016 at 1:19 pm –
The petitioners can’t withdraw it if it’s accepted under home rule.
If it’s accepted under Faulkner Act, then yes it can be withdrawn.
2:02pm- Interesting to know that subtlety, thanks!
John V.- And where do you stand on Valley ? Just curious.
John V. You are a troll. No one cares, is excited by, is influenced by, or actually listens to your ramblings. You have a talent for one thing. Reading documents and regurgitating the info in them.
If you think you have any actual influence or weight, if you think anyone cares if you’ve given the same advice to Gwenn, Roberta or Santa Claus, you’re totally mistaken.
All you do is embarrass your very sweet and intelligent wife who it would appear seeks to do some good in this town, and offer her talents and expertise without being a jerk. I watch these meetings in tv and I see the social media and SHE is an asset and seems quite lovely.
If you would kindly just go away, or be forever quiet, I think we as a community would agree it would be Wonderful.
I would happily vote on that in ANY election special or otherwise. I’d pay $40k for it. Just. Be. Quiet, you insufferable, obnoxious, blowhard.
I am so bothered that this good work by these good people is being trolled and taken over by John V and his blathering. Go away, troll.
2:15pm – peace. This will all be over by May 10th. We all will still be neighbors for YEARS to come.
2:14pm-
I haven’t studied the Valley issue very deeply, so please take these as tentative opinions. I agree with the idea of “renewal” in general, since I think growth and progress and development are on net good. But I’m very concerned that Valley didn’t exercise all available options to move high traffic activities to more suitable locations and thus reduce the size of the expansion at the Ridgewood site. The “compromise” seems more weighted to Valley than Ridgewood. The legal issues are complicated and I don’t really understand them. I’m more concerned about the impacts during construction (traffic, noise, dust) than I am about long-term impacts on the neighborhood, though I’m sure there will be some impact. In conclusion, the expansion seems a bit too big, too much in favor of valley, and I don’t think they’ve committed to a “lowest possible impact” construction plan. (I also think Valley should start paying property taxes or an equivalent fee to the village!)
2:21pm-
Sorry you feel that way! In my defense, I think several of you are over-reacting to my simple request for a slightly more nuanced way of describing the special election situation.
I respect the petitioners and have had very pleasant interactions with several of them. My request for nuance and accuracy is not at all meant to “take down” the hard work they did and support they generated. I disagree with their position, and didn’t sign, but I support their right to use the tools they did to oppose an ordinance.
2:15pm-
I’m sorry you feel that I’m a troll! Most online trolls I’ve encountered use the exact opposite style of rhetoric and debate that I do. They also tend to attack individuals on a personal level. None of those are my M.O., as I hope is evident.
I do agree with you that I have almost no “influence or weight”. I am not active in town politics really, other than on a few specific issues and a few specific forums. So why would I have any particular influence or weight on decision-makers? (Though for what it’s worth, Mike Sedon did call me the day before the last garage funding vote to make sure that the mistakes in the garage renderings I pointed out didn’t greatly affect things. And Dana G did send me one of his Its2Big flyers for a once-over before he distributed it.)
Also, I give advice and point out inaccuracies to all sides mostly for my own sense of honesty. It would not feel honest to me to criticize someone for an issue and not criticize the other side for the exact same thing. Intellectual honesty and consistency are strong values for me. If you or others don’t care about those attempts to be consistent, so be it.
My wife is definitely a lovely and intelligent person! Thank you for the compliment.
I politely disagree with your assessment of my own qualities, but you are certainly entitled to your own opinion.
John V.- Saw your response regarding Valley. My concerns are both short and long term, as they were for the people in Princeton. The short(7 yrs.?!?) speaks for itself, but the long really scares me, and not because of what could easily happen to that neighborhood, but for the entire town. Ridgewood gains zero from this, except more aggravation then it currently gets. What some people just don’t understand is that wherever you have expanded a hospital to a Medical Center(Morristown,Hackensack, St.Joe’s), the expanded areas in those neighborhoods have aided in the deterioration of those towns. The bigger they got, the more problems they caused.
Bill H at 4:23pm-
Thanks Bill. My point about short-term impacts being of greater concern is probably b/c I’m a bit of a long-term optimist? The short-term impacts are definitely detrimental, but maybe the long-term impacts could go either way? The houses right around the future busy hospital are already next to the current busy hospital, so will the neighborhood really be that different after construction is complete? (Again, I haven’t studied this issue at all, so these are very naive comments and questions. Please weigh that accordingly.) I would feel better about growth if it was also helping with the tax base in town.
I’m not familiar enough with the relevant examples (Princeton, Morristown, etc.) to comment one way or another, but the possibility of a hospital expansion having a serious detrimental long-term impact on a town certainly concerns me. If you know, could you say more about the mechanisms by which hospital expansion has caused negative impacts in those other towns? More traffic -> Worse quality of life -> General deterioration?
John V.-The Princeton situation was resolved by moving the hospital, which was on Witherspoon St., to Plainsboro, one town over. The hospital got the room they needed and the area where they were is being developed with more housing. Morristown, at one time compared to Ridgewood as an upscale town you would want to raise a family in, is no longer what it was. Take a ride down 287, get off at the exit that takes you to the CBD, and see the results.Take a look at the people catching buses from the area around the hospital, and the CBD. Trust me, they are not doctors and nurses. More importantly, as the hospital got bigger, the area around the hospital got worse as residents sold. And if you don’t think the housing values suffered in the whole town, think again. It happened there, and it happened in Hackensack. That’s what people in this town should be paying attention to, among other things.
Bill H. at 6:33pm-
Thanks, I appreciate the context and history. I actually lived in Morristown for a few years as a teenager, and was even a “Big Brother” to a kid living off MLK Ave in the Hollow, so I’m familiar with the greater socioeconomic diversity in Morristown compared to Ridgewood. I’ll definitely read up more on the history of the medical center and how it might have impacted things.
Re: Princeton, I actually lived there after Morristown, but I was totally unaware the medical center had moved to Plainsboro! Definitely a Valley analogue since everything around there was residential. Interesting that they decided to move rather than try to grow in the original location. Maybe Overlook in Summit is an analogue as well to Valley?
Bill H. So so true.
Please excuse me mixing topics – but can a petition be used to challenge the high density housing project. Another tremendous disappointment in council votes.
John V.- I have been to Summit, but never to Overlook. I really don’t know what has happened there over the years. Regarding Princeton, the hospital ran out of room to do what they felt they wanted/ needed so, with the blessing of the town, they moved. Smart move for everyone. By the way, “the socioeconomic diversity” to which you refer to in Morristown came about, in very large part, to the expansion of Morristown Memorial. It took time, but that’s what happened. And the administrators and doctors that were there during their “growth phase,” they’re retired living comfortably in Arizona, Florida, or wherever.
I’d repeal ordinance 3066, go after Valley’s “not-for-profit” status as long as it takes in the courts without settling, and then I would sue them for back taxes as well.
Anonymous at 12:36am-
I believe I read that zoning / planning ordinances are specifically exempt from the petition / referendum process according to state law. If that true, then can’t use petition re: high density housing.
“Maybe Overlook in Summit is an analogue as well to Valley?” – my friends in summit send their kids to private school. Our school is better than summit.
9:34am-
I was talking more about a hospital being located in a primarily residential, affluent community. But good point about schools. Private school definitely seems to be a bigger thing in those towns.
I grew up in the town next door to Summit and went to public school through middle school, but then went to private high school. I never realized growing up that the Ridgewood area doesn’t have the academically strong private schools that you have in the Summit area (Pingry, Delbarton, Oak Knoll, Kent Place, etc). Private schools closest to Ridgewood seem to focus more on sports than on academics?